• Have I crossed the line? Support theft and Facebook drama.

  • Have a controversial viewpoint related to the sport? Turn up your BS meter, raise your red flag, and hash out your buggy gripes and pet peeves here! Keep it reasonably civil, and present your case!
November 2019 Forum Retirement
Due to lack of extra personal time (and too much spam), I'm retiring the forum and setting it to a read-only state. No new registrations or posts will be accepted as of 11/09/19. However, all information will stay up and searchable. If you spend a few minutes searching, you'll find the answers you're looking for. We may re-open the forum next spring.
Have a controversial viewpoint related to the sport? Turn up your BS meter, raise your red flag, and hash out your buggy gripes and pet peeves here! Keep it reasonably civil, and present your case!
 #12989  by Travis @ Buggy Depot
 Sun Nov 25, 2018 11:34 am
At BD, we're in survival mode until things hopefully pick up in Spring. It's not just us. The entire Buggy sport is hurting. Amazon and eBay are after pure profits, and are crushing all of us enthusiast-based businesses who actually care about Buggies and who care about you.

You don't have to take my word for it, here's what Tom from KidNMe has to say about the state things from where he stands. The same goes for several other long-standing names of providers in the market who are in the same situation, but haven't spoken publicly. This sport is sinking, and needs a shift in direction right now.


Back here at BD, I also wrote a post explaining to my paying customers why our support is suffering. Why we're not getting some orders out on time, or able to reliably pick up the phone. I don't like talking indirectly, so I decided to give a real reason:

Here's the full article for context.

I've always refused to charge for our technical support, and I rely on the honor system to stay in business.

Charles' comment accurately describes one of the biggest ways that we're bleeding... people using our support to buy elsewhere. I spent 6 months between 6pm and 3am, almost every night, to build the verification system. I put in 11,000 verifications by hand, after measuring and identifying each part for each model. That's a lot of time away from my family, with the understanding with my Wife that it would help support them. After doing the right thing putting in the sweat and the hours to make real support and information available to all, my people and I should NOT be punished by seeing Buggy Depot's site used as a Buyer's Guide for eBay and Amazon. Padding corporate executive's pockets while I'm struggling to pay people to pick up the phone.

What Charles described is support theft that takes food directly off my table, and I'm not willing to put this into kinder terms to spare his feelings. I don't want this getting all twisted up. I'm not calling Charles a thief. But he knew what he was doing, and he knew what he was saying.

Now, I imagine Charles didn't like this because he put me on blast late last night. Not here on BD where he read my post, and not to me directly. Straight to Facebook. Now to be clear: I wasn't looking to make a point of Charles himself or cause him any damage, which is why I blurred out his picture and name in my original post to protect his anonymity and identity.

Charles, you didn't offer me the same courtesy. Rather than contacting me directly, you went straight for where you thought it would do me some damage:



Charles, you're free to come and address me here directly. Hashing out disagreements and reaching a resolution is what this section of the forum is meant for. A lot of people gripe and complain, but it's not often a person is willing to actually have a conversation that helps fix the root problem. In either case, if you've got a bone to pick with something I've said, this is the appropriate place to do it. You're free to speak your mind, there are no filters or censors here.
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 #12991  by Travis @ Buggy Depot
 Sun Nov 25, 2018 12:34 pm
In addition to Charles, I've also invited the owner of RCH Motorsports here. It appears she agrees with Charles, so it would be good if she chooses to advocate for him.

My intention is to work towards an open agreement with anyone and everyone regarding what "support" should mean going forward in this unsupported Chinese market. I feel like I've been pulling a disproportionate amount of the technical burden for too many years now, and if other vendors want to step up into a more impactful role we can talk about that.

It's left up to the community itself to define what is acceptable and unacceptable behavior. Let's talk about where things are heading for all of us if we don't change direction a bit.

 #13144  by PGH
 Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:44 pm
Rhonda was very defensive and evasive when asked about her performance engines. Evidently you do not get any data on what you buy until after the sale?
 #13145  by Travis @ Buggy Depot
 Sat Feb 02, 2019 4:53 pm
Glad to see you posting again Pete.

I recently saw Rhonda tell a guy that RCH could rebuild a HOWHIT into a 232cc. What she apparently didn't know is that the maximum bore and stroke combination that'll physically fit the case is 190cc. And unless a builder has gone through extensive R&D to address specific issues, it will be an unstable and unreliable build.

It's OK for a seller to not to know things and fumble their way through support, as long as intentions are in the right place. But it's hypocritical to act like an authoritative source of information when it's clear that the owners are just newbies. Same goes for Rhonda weighing in with a negative reaction in the situation above. If she genuinely has a negative opinion on the issue, she should be able to articulate it so we can have a constructive conversation and help define the norms of the sport.

Throwing out a few angry emojis just felt like she was playing Charles for his money. He feels he's found a reliable source of Kandi parts and can burn the bridge here rather than reconciling with me. But that's foolish. RCH can't supply parts long term when Kandi decides to discontinue his model. When it comes to parts, they appear provide very little benefit to Charles or anyone else beyond being a middleman.

That's just my opinion though. The floor is still open here for Rhonda or Charles to speak.
 #13147  by PGH
 Sat Feb 02, 2019 8:02 pm
I will say that RCH is bringing back buggy racing in the northeast which helps expose these rides to more people since Kid-n-Me got out of the scene. John, down in FL, is doing a better job, but I also think he has a better grip on the racing scene. I see nothing like this in the Midwest or anywhere on the Pacific coast. The northwest recently has started UTV competitions, but cost to be competitive is prohibitive to many that have other financial responsibilities.